Property Management Mess

C

ChrisOs

Hi.

I am having a bit of a hassle with a townhouse in Queensland at the moment (I live in Adelaide) that somebody may be able to help me with.

To cut a long story short, the property managers (PM A) who were looking after the townhouse for me sold the property management part of their business to the newly selected body corporate appointed on-site managers (PM B). They had no experience of property management so I appointed another property manager (PM C), before they got a chance to do anything. A couple of weeks prior to this change, the lease expired and new tenants were found by PM A. The new tenants have advised PM C that they are paid up to the 5th April, but the money from the time since PM A sold their business to PM B and PM C took over (three weeks rent) has gone "missing". PM C have received no money from the tenants, as they made their payment to 5th ApPril the day before PM C took over. PM B said there was no money transferred from PM A to their account for the property. Confused? So am I!

My question - if my leaning on PM A does not make the money magically re-appear, what is the authority (is there one?) in Queensland that I should follow this up with?

Thanks,
Chris.
P.S. I switched PMs because I never had confidence in PM A. They were never open and honest with me and had too many other businesses on the go to take sufficient time to do a good job. They were affiliated with the builder and they "came with the property".
 
Wow...

After several reads, I think I understand what you are asking.

Quite simply, ask the tenants if they have a receipt (or bank transfer acknowledgement) for the paid rent. If they have this, ask them for a copy. (I'm sure PMC will be happy to help you talk to the tenants about getting this)

Take this proof of rental payment to PMA and ask them for the audit trail of the money through their trust account.
They MUST keep this auditable trail of money through their account, it is the legislation.

In reality, if PMA had transferred their managements to PMB, they would not have transferred ANY money unless it was rent payments in advance. They would have paid the landlords out as at the settlement date, and would have simply transferred the information and any rent paid in advance. (They MAY have kept rent paid in advance to disburse themselves, but this would be between PMA and PMB). Either way, there HAS to be an audit trail.

This will enable you to see whether the money went into PMA's bank, and if so, where it went from there. If it went to PMB's bank, they will have to have a similar audit trail.

PMC should be able to help you follow this through, however, if you would like any help at all from me, please email me at [email protected] and I will be more than happy to help you in any way I can.

hope this helps,

asy :D
 
Thank you very much Asy.

PMC seemed reluctant to get involved ("We haven't received any money") was the best I could get out of them, but I will ask them to help out as you suggested. The Property Manager is fairly inexperienced, though she works for a reputable Brisbane agency and can easily ask for help if necessary.

PMB were adamant that there was no money transferred to their account.

PMA *may* still come good - when I called today, the response was "I'll look into it on the weekend". I never had a good feeling about PMA and I am sure they have exagerrated to me in the past (I am being kind - they probably lied).

We will see.

Thanks.
Chris.
 
Hi Chris (and Asy)

I'm surprised PMC isn't going in to bat for you. They are now being paid by you to look after your best interests. What an opportunity to build immediate goodwill. It's a bit bloody hard for you from Adelaide to see the trail and Asy suggested.

Anyway, if you don't get a satisfactory answer soon contact the Office of Fair Trading on 07 3246 1500 or the Minister, Merri Rose on 07 3224 2004

Kev

www.nundahrealestate.com.au
 
Thanks Kev.

I will see what happens today (Monday) when I call PMA again.

Hope I don't have to call the Office of Fair Trading, but that is a good piece of advice to keep up my sleeve, if all else fails.

Chris.
 
From what you've said about PM C's actions they dont exactly strike me as motivated to keep your business !
 
Thought it was time to give an update on where this mess is currently at.

After several calls to PM A, they said "a cheque is in the mail" but it has to be paid to a property manager and they can't pay it directly to me (keep in mind that PM A is now out of the property management game). They said they would forward the funds to PM C. Calls to PM C proved that it wasn't in the mail (no surprise there). PM C called PM A, who then admitted "our records are in a bit of a mess".

A senior manager at PM C is now involved and he said he would initially take the softly, softly approach (I told him it wouldn't work) and then apply some pressure. There has been no response from PM A, so the latest from PM C is that he was to call the REIQ yesterday, to find out what to do next.

I wait in hope!
Chris.
 
Originally posted by ChrisOs


I wait in hope!
Chris.
Click to expand...

G'Day Chris, my advice to you is whilst waiting, start looking for PM D, I personally wouldn't put up with PM Cs "soft cok" approach.
From what I've read here, I'm not convinced they have earnt the right to manage your property, I would tell them in no uncertain terms, "sort it out or see you later"

You have better things to do, that's why you appoint a property manager, tell them to start managing and stop pussyfooting around.

I think you have been extremely patient, by now I would have had the baseball bat out.

regards
 
Originally posted by Jakk
G'Day Chris, my advice to you is whilst waiting, start looking for PM D, I personally wouldn't put up with PM Cs "soft cok" approach.
From what I've read here, I'm not convinced they have earnt the right to manage your property, I would tell them in no uncertain terms, "sort it out or see you later"

You have better things to do, that's why you appoint a property manager, tell them to start managing and stop pussyfooting around.

I think you have been extremely patient, by now I would have had the baseball bat out.

regards
Click to expand...



Ditto


Kev

www.nundahrealestate.com.au
 
Originally posted by Glenn
Jakk,

Is it the same bat you had when standing to the side of a tenant's door while knocking??

Glenn
Click to expand...

G'Day Glenn,

your memory is good but slightly flawed, That post that you are referring to which if i remember correctly was about 12 months ago. I wrote that I remembered reading in Donald Trumps book "The Art of the Deal" that as a young boy, Donald would accompany his fathers rent collectors as the went around collecting rents from his fathers apartments and they carried a piece.
He (Donald Trump) also wrote that they would knock on the door while standing to the side and quickly withdraw their arms as there had been occasions where the tenants had fired shots at the door from the inside.
As I wrote then and I'll repeat now, That is what I call high risk investing.

I tried to find the original post on a search but with no success, what I did find though was the actual thread in which my transformation to the Slum Lord came about in which I think you also played a part in back then. For a little nostalgia, look up the thread "Census stats" in the "WebBoard Property Investor Forum Archive" great for a little lighthearted relief.

Ahhh the good old days

regards
 
Hi Jakk.

The idea of carrying a "piece" (a la Donald Trump) and shoving it in PM A's face, does appeal to me. There are a couple of things stopping me:
1) It's illegal
2) I'm in Adelaide and won't be in Brisbane again until early June.

What I would like to know though, if this was your dilemma, what would be the hard-nosed approach that you would take? Yelling over the phone probably won't work and even the Aunty Jack "I'll rip yer bloody arms off" threat won't cut it 2,000kms away either.

PM C has said that the REIQ are not the appropriate organisation to call, so will call the Office of Fair Trading (as Kevin suggested). (PM C has been busy so last I heard on Thursday, he was still to do this.)

Asy - I may end up calling you after all! (You don't do property management in Carindale/Mount Gravatt do you?)

Regards,
Chris
 
Originally posted by ChrisOs
Hi Jakk.


What I would like to know though, if this was your dilemma, what would be the hard-nosed approach that you would take? Yelling over the phone probably won't work and even the Aunty Jack "I'll rip yer bloody arms off" threat won't cut it 2,000kms away either.



Mate, I wouldn't need a phone, they'd hear me yelling from Adelaide.



PM C has said that the REIQ are not the appropriate organisation to call, so will call the Office of Fair Trading (as Kevin suggested). (PM C has been busy so last I heard on Thursday, he was still to do this.)


C'mon Chris, too busy to make a phone call or couldn't be bothered?
I have serious doubts about this PM being the one I'd let handle my property.
I must admit I do admire your patience, by now (20 days +), I reckon I would have been on a plane up there.
.....Oh, I forgot to ask, do you actually pay this PM or are they doing it for free?
and you know what the worst thing is? its real estate people like this that give the majority of Decent Real Estate Agents out there a bad name. This matter should have been resolved a lot earlier and you should have already spent your money by now.
Once again, I cant believe how patient you have been.
Click to expand...

regards
 
Gday ChrisOs,
l had a problem with rent comming later and later , rang PM bla bla bla,bla bla bla etc. SHE suggested l ring Agency Owner and tell him all about my suggestion to solve this problem as it was an internal problem with his staff requesting my tennant not to pay his rent in cash,l did and problem solved.

Have you rang the person with their name on the door?
MITCH.
 
Originally posted by ChrisOs
Asy - I may end up calling you after all! (You don't do property management in Carindale/Mount Gravatt do you?)
Click to expand...

I'm in Capalaba, Chris, so I'd be happy to look after it for you if it's in carindale/Mt Gravatt.

My kettle's always hot, so drop in and I'll make you a cuppa!

Even if you don't want me to look after the property for you, I'd be more than happy to help you if I can. Give me a call and I'll give you a hand making sure this gets resolved. 07 3390 1699.

asy :D
 
Hi Jakk,

Boyed by the fact that nostalgia isn't what it used to be I went and found that thread again and had a read......aaaahh flashbacks!! No mention of "stubboirs" (a term I have taken on board) but a goody none the less.

Seeing that this thread was started by someone managing property in another state than that which they live, could you comment on your thoughts about this?

Glenn
 
The Final Chapter!

After several more phone calls (including one to Asy), a lot of patience and fretting on my part, I have now received all the money that I was due. On reflection, there were a number of issues, including the timing of the changing of Property Managers, the fact that PM A never advised the tenants that they were no longer the Property Managers (I didn't I find out until well over a week after PM A had sold their property management business and transferred clients to PM B) and that PM A had/have so much else on the go that they could never find the time to resolve my problems.

Anyway, it was a learning experience for me and one that I can only benefit from. Easy for me to say now!

Thank you to all those who have offered advice and assistance.
(I will be in Brisbane Sunday 8th and Monday 9th June - I may try and catch up with Asy and Kevin while I am there - I will see what I can arrange before then and will be in touch.)

Regards,
Chris.
 
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