No science there.
A so-called alkaline diet seems to promote what would generally be considered a healthy diet...
Congratulations on your positive lifestyle changes.
Has anyone drank Alkaline Water before? Lost weight and cured chronic fatigue!
- Thread starter Georges
- Start date
No science there.
A so-called alkaline diet seems to promote what would generally be considered a healthy diet...
Congratulations on your positive lifestyle changes.
Look, I am not the inventor of alkaline water or the theory for it. Enough said. You guys are attacking me like I am the person who came up with the science or theory. All I can say is IT WORKED FOR ME. And I'm proud and happyto declare of my health improvement.
Winstonwolfe, I am only stating my positive experience with alkaline water. Is that wrong? I am talking about MY EXPERIENCE, not about YOUR EPERIENCE. If I were talking about YOUR EXPERIENCE, then maybe you can refute it. But it seems like you are very 100% confirmed (but only your assumption) that the water does absolutely nothing for me.
Well your assumption is your priviledge. You can assume anything you want. You can assume all the testimonials from people who have experienced benefits from it are all false and fake. It's just your ASSUMPTION. Seems like you know much more about MY health than myself. Also, calling me self-delusional, please. You are the one who said I was on booze.To me, you are the one who has never tried something and come out to claim like you know everything about it. EXPERIENCE and RESULT mate, the 2 things you don't have. And I DO!
Believe it or not for all I care.
bye
Winstonwolfe, I am only stating my positive experience with alkaline water. Is that wrong? I am talking about MY EXPERIENCE, not about YOUR EPERIENCE. If I were talking about YOUR EXPERIENCE, then maybe you can refute it. But it seems like you are very 100% confirmed (but only your assumption) that the water does absolutely nothing for me.
Well your assumption is your priviledge. You can assume anything you want. You can assume all the testimonials from people who have experienced benefits from it are all false and fake. It's just your ASSUMPTION. Seems like you know much more about MY health than myself. Also, calling me self-delusional, please. You are the one who said I was on booze.To me, you are the one who has never tried something and come out to claim like you know everything about it. EXPERIENCE and RESULT mate, the 2 things you don't have. And I DO!
Believe it or not for all I care.
bye
HK and George, as I pointed out, new age natural therapy come out with a new remedy every few years....it gets a lot of hype and press, sales go through the roof, then it peters out as the emotive and desperate don't get better and stop buying it......funny how they also forget about it and latch onto the next brand new thing a few years later.
You guys seem like you came down in the last shower, otherwise you would have tried all the other natural therapies I mentioned above. Here's a test for you. Why not find out how many other natural products Anthony Robbins has promoted in the last 15 years?
I don't need to try ionized water cos I tried all the other things, and now my mindset is that I don't believe anything promoted by anyone until it has had proper clinical trials.
I could say to you yeah I got better trying this 10,000 year old Ayurvedic therapy. and come onto the forum and blow off about how much good it did me.....and some people on here would believe it.....and I hazard a guess some of them would even try it when I told them what it is....cos I can build a reasonable scientific rationale for it......the therapy is
- drink 250mls of your own urine 2 x a day for a month
- eat 3 marble sized dried balls of yak's dung a day for 14 days.
Now I know guys who have done this. And they swore they got better.
But are you guys going to try that if I tell you? I doubt it.
I could get an ayurvedic doctor to tell you about its healing powers? That'd probably almost convince you to try it.
But what makes an ayurvedic doctor better than a western doctor. Just because ayurvedic has been around for 10,000 years, does that make it right? 1000 years ago westerners used to use drilll a hole in your head if you had a headache.....does that mean it was the right therapy?
Just because something has been around for a long time, doesn't mean it is right. Just because a guy like Robbins who loves an opulent lifestyle endorses something, doesn't mean it's true. As well intentioned as he is, he isn't a scientist qualified to review the research of anyone.
Enjoy your water guys. I've got other things to do tonight.
You guys seem like you came down in the last shower, otherwise you would have tried all the other natural therapies I mentioned above. Here's a test for you. Why not find out how many other natural products Anthony Robbins has promoted in the last 15 years?
I don't need to try ionized water cos I tried all the other things, and now my mindset is that I don't believe anything promoted by anyone until it has had proper clinical trials.
I could say to you yeah I got better trying this 10,000 year old Ayurvedic therapy. and come onto the forum and blow off about how much good it did me.....and some people on here would believe it.....and I hazard a guess some of them would even try it when I told them what it is....cos I can build a reasonable scientific rationale for it......the therapy is
- drink 250mls of your own urine 2 x a day for a month
- eat 3 marble sized dried balls of yak's dung a day for 14 days.
Now I know guys who have done this. And they swore they got better.
But are you guys going to try that if I tell you? I doubt it.
I could get an ayurvedic doctor to tell you about its healing powers? That'd probably almost convince you to try it.
But what makes an ayurvedic doctor better than a western doctor. Just because ayurvedic has been around for 10,000 years, does that make it right? 1000 years ago westerners used to use drilll a hole in your head if you had a headache.....does that mean it was the right therapy?
Just because something has been around for a long time, doesn't mean it is right. Just because a guy like Robbins who loves an opulent lifestyle endorses something, doesn't mean it's true. As well intentioned as he is, he isn't a scientist qualified to review the research of anyone.
Enjoy your water guys. I've got other things to do tonight.
Winstonwolfe,
so in essense you believe nothing other than what the clinical doctor says. Enough said. Good luck!
If doctors really knew everything and are always right, then the world wouldn't be having more cancers, more heart disease, more this and thats. Boy are you a good customer to the trillion dollar drug and medical industry! Enjoy your panadols!
so in essense you believe nothing other than what the clinical doctor says. Enough said. Good luck!
If doctors really knew everything and are always right, then the world wouldn't be having more cancers, more heart disease, more this and thats. Boy are you a good customer to the trillion dollar drug and medical industry! Enjoy your panadols!
I have never tried it but watching this thread remind me of conversation between PI from somersoft and GHPC.
PI: "We know it works, we have experienced it first hand."
Cynics: "Well according to the economic model that I read that can't be right."
If you area healthy and don't need it then good for you, save your money. But if you have one of the health problems that it supposedly can cure or help and seeing your doctors haven't really helped, what's the harm of spending a bit of money to try it out? What's a few hundred dollars (the low end model) compared to your health?
PI: "We know it works, we have experienced it first hand."
Cynics: "Well according to the economic model that I read that can't be right."
If you area healthy and don't need it then good for you, save your money. But if you have one of the health problems that it supposedly can cure or help and seeing your doctors haven't really helped, what's the harm of spending a bit of money to try it out? What's a few hundred dollars (the low end model) compared to your health?
Come on George, you are just revealing your ignorance now.
We aren't talking about medicine, we are talking about science.
You prefer to write off every good thing science has given mankind, and swallow what some guy says who won't even publish a proper scientific study.
Dietitians, doctors, and scientists are pretty sure what advances artheroscelorsis and heart disease.....and tell people ad infinitum....the trouble is, people look for quick fixes like ionized water to undo all the lack of will power they display in drinking booze and eating rubbish and sitting on theri bums too much.
Some things aren't rocket science George. Westerners in general have so little willl power nowadays they'd prefer to give someone a fistful of dollars to give them some water.
I tell you what....have a think about the ionized water business model......it is pretty bloody good. the only way they could improve it now is to dehydrate the ionized water, and packet it in freeze dried satchels.....just add water when you get home
this would cut down on their distribution costs significantly......hahahhaahttp://youtube.com/watch?v=OHfnarU3Ha4
DR. Robert O Young (phd) interviewed about diabetes on TV. He has done controlled group studies on diabetic patients. 96% stops their need for insulin injection while they are on alkaline diet.
The medical community is all about fixing up problems and symptoms. Medical docs are not necessarily educated in nutrition or prevention of disease. Like Deepak Chopra (MD) said, doctors seem more like drug salesman for the mega-rich drug companies, and Chopra was once a doctor! Most medical research are done by drug companies, how is that for vested interest on the other end. ("Cancer is killing you, take more xyz drug eventhough it has lots of negative side effects"). The best time to prevent a disease is before you get it. Most of diseases are caused by dietary and lifestyle patterns. Prevention or Curing, make your choice.
DR. Robert O Young (phd) interviewed about diabetes on TV. He has done controlled group studies on diabetic patients. 96% stops their need for insulin injection while they are on alkaline diet.
The medical community is all about fixing up problems and symptoms. Medical docs are not necessarily educated in nutrition or prevention of disease. Like Deepak Chopra (MD) said, doctors seem more like drug salesman for the mega-rich drug companies, and Chopra was once a doctor! Most medical research are done by drug companies, how is that for vested interest on the other end. ("Cancer is killing you, take more xyz drug eventhough it has lots of negative side effects"). The best time to prevent a disease is before you get it. Most of diseases are caused by dietary and lifestyle patterns. Prevention or Curing, make your choice.
Come on George, you are just revealing your ignorance now.
We aren't talking about medicine, we are talking about science.
Dietitians, doctors, and scientists are pretty sure what advances artheroscelorsis and heart disease.....and tell people ad infinitum....the trouble is, people look for quick fixes like ionized water to undo all the lack of will power they display in drinking booze and eating rubbish and sitting on theri bums too much.
Some things aren't rocket science George. Westerners in general have so little willl power nowadays they'd prefer to give someone a fistful of dollars to give them some water.
I tell you what....have a think about the ionized water business model......it is pretty bloody good. the only way they could improve it now is to dehydrate the ionized water, and packet it in freeze dried satchels.....just add water when you get home
hi WW,
You were talking about medicine and aryuveda. Why can't George talk about medicine too? After all, you were talking about disease and cancers. That's very "medical" so stop changing the subject yourself. I don't think George is ignorant. He was merely sharing what he knows about it and most importantly his experiences.
You come as a disbeliever which is fine, but you can't and shouldn't make false asumptions about George by saying his testimonial is false or selfdelusion. Stop using labels such as ignorant as if you are so smart. It is plain rude. By the way are you a doctor? If you think western medicine is perfect and like to take medicine after you get something, that is very smart of you. I'm all for prevention rather than cure. Not all alternative methods are delusional you know? I am sure someone as smart as you would have figured that out sooner.
Medical docs are not necessarily trained about disease prevention. By the way where do medical doctors get their knowledge? From research scientists, mirco-biologists who studies blood cells ecetra. Also from the multi-billion dollar drug company industry.
I'm sticking to my alkaline water too (drinkin' it for 4 yrs and still loving it!)
my cholestrol level has become normal after taking ion-ised alkaline water for about 6 - 8 mths. I too beat fatigue problem and sinus problem. Results came gradually, not in the blink of an eye.
sure it's not a magic cure where you drink 1 glass and the problems all gone. The body has to get rid of the excess acid wastes slowly first by neutralizing it with alkalinity. Then results will show. If you still don't think it works, then alright go to your doctor. But if your doctor could help you in the first place, you wouldn't be looking for alternative methods anyway.
Took a life blood sample, and it now shows my red blood cells are now normal and round. If you go to Antony Robbin's seminar and Mastery university, he makes almost everyone who consents to take a live blood sample. People who are stressed, acidic and have health problems can see the condition of their live red blood cells with their own eyes. Yeasts, broken cells, clumped cells, for all to see. Then after they make the dietary change to alkaline, to see the difference in your red blood cells. Sure he ain't no doctor. But that is his way of showing proof to the cynics, hard core experience and proof. Not theories, not analysis, not medical papers. Only in-your-face proof and results.
sure it's not a magic cure where you drink 1 glass and the problems all gone. The body has to get rid of the excess acid wastes slowly first by neutralizing it with alkalinity. Then results will show. If you still don't think it works, then alright go to your doctor. But if your doctor could help you in the first place, you wouldn't be looking for alternative methods anyway.
Took a life blood sample, and it now shows my red blood cells are now normal and round. If you go to Antony Robbin's seminar and Mastery university, he makes almost everyone who consents to take a live blood sample. People who are stressed, acidic and have health problems can see the condition of their live red blood cells with their own eyes. Yeasts, broken cells, clumped cells, for all to see. Then after they make the dietary change to alkaline, to see the difference in your red blood cells. Sure he ain't no doctor. But that is his way of showing proof to the cynics, hard core experience and proof. Not theories, not analysis, not medical papers. Only in-your-face proof and results.
woohoo, I've said above I believe in the health benefits of an alkaline type diet, which is the same as western medicine recommend. lots of fruit and vege, easy on the animal products and starch. Dean Ornish was espousing this 20 years ago. and Pritikin 40 years ago, and Ann Wigmore, Norman Walker, the Natural Hygiene Mvt etc etc etc.....you guys obviously are young and don't see that Alkaline is ancient history.
don't confuse the benefits a good diet bring with the water scam.
WW,
like I said and i say again, i too experienced good results with ion-ised alkaline water too. What scam are you talking about?? I don't understand. You yourself don't have any first hand experience in this at all and yet make all kinds of claims about why it doesn't work.
If DR. Robert O Young is talking about benefits of alkaline diet, and he does research, studies, give lectures to medical doctors about his findings, shows the proof in people's red blood cells samples, and he himself owns a water alkalising machine and drinks alkaline water.... I'm sure he has done some test on his own blood before he commits to drinking alkaline water.
Another interview of DR Robert O Young.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4s6cTQtK_E&NR=1
One of his scientific/research lectures about blood and pH. Shows some of his experiments. (VERY GOOD clip)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy2dpquLTJA&feature=related
like I said and i say again, i too experienced good results with ion-ised alkaline water too. What scam are you talking about??
I don't understand. You yourself don't have any first hand experience in this at all and yet make all kinds of claims about why it doesn't work.If DR. Robert O Young is talking about benefits of alkaline diet, and he does research, studies, give lectures to medical doctors about his findings, shows the proof in people's red blood cells samples, and he himself owns a water alkalising machine and drinks alkaline water.... I'm sure he has done some test on his own blood before he commits to drinking alkaline water.
Another interview of DR Robert O Young.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4s6cTQtK_E&NR=1
One of his scientific/research lectures about blood and pH. Shows some of his experiments. (VERY GOOD clip)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy2dpquLTJA&feature=related
Drinking the same amount of normal water would have had similar results.
Although it's not all bad news, the fact that the machine motivates you to drink more water it's a plus.
For me, I am not convinced that the alcaline water theory has anything to offer so I will stick to my filtered water from the tap.
Good summary...
Dr Young is a nutritionist/microbiologist and research scientist. He does have patients of his own, as a research scientist/microbilogist/nutritionist.
Example, he cured a woman with high cholestrol and her cholestrol went down from 420 to 212 in a few months. Her parents and everyone in her family had a history of high cholestrol, and all of them died in when they reach their 40s. Medical doctors couldn't do anything to help reduce her cholestrol. But Dr Young cured her with just asking her to change her diet to more alkaline and let her drink alkaline drinks. This case was also made known to Dr Solomon of the National Inst of Health(NIH) and he saw the test results himself, hence it blew him away. (reference, Tony Robbins interviewing Dr Young)
Why do some doctors want to attack Dr Young? Because Young's theory is that you can cure a lot of disease by just balancing your pH imbalance. Maybe not all, but a lot. The medical doctors don't believe that cholestrol has anything to do with pH balance. They prefer to sell pharmaceutical drugs. Some take legal action against him saying he's not a MD, and he shouldn't be giving medical advice. But the person who achieved the result and saved lives is Dr Young. Not the Medical doctors. Hmmm, I smell a case of jealousy here.
All Dr Young can do now is to put a disclaimer to all his patients saying something like "look im not a MD, im a nutritionist and microbiologist. I see things in your blood samples that a MD wouldn't know and wouldn't understand. If you think MD's advice are better, you can continue to take the medicine they give you, and you can try my recommendation only as a secondary treatment. All I ask of you is to try change your diet, maybe your disease will be cured. Or maybe not, you won't know until you are open minded enough to change your diet. It definitely won't kill you to eat more vegetables. But please bloody dont come and sue me!"
So what do you guys want,
1)medical credentials that can't save a patient's life and give drugs with negative side effects, or
2) a scientist who has done research, studied the condition of the blood, done controlled group studies and proved his theory is sound, prescribed a cure(which has no negative side effects) and actually cured a person.
take your pick!
Ziggy,
since you don't believe me, then I think yes, you should stick to your filtered water. I am not here to persuade you to buy anything!
But I stick to my experience that the water has done more good to me than you think. I am living the result myself, and that is good enough. Like I said, I was drinking the same amount of water every day, before and after I bought the machine. So it is not just a matter of me drinking more water. Same amount of water, a few litres a day. But different type of water with different pH value.
Before the machine I was drinking from tap(filtered), sometimes from bottled mineral water (Evian etc), but they didn't show me any improvement. Only made me bloated if I drank a lot. In fact, testing mineral bottle water with a pH strip showed a pH of 5 - 6. So the bottled water was adding more acid into our body. Might as well drink soft drinks by the litres.
The alkaline water from the machine, when you test with a pH strip, the strip turns dark blue, showing a true alkaline. Why do you and winstonwolfe keep insisting that the water is not alkaline? You never even tested or tried it, yet claim so strongly that the water doesn't work? Tap water is only neutral or just slightly alkaline around pH7.3. You would need to drink a lot more times/portions of ph7.3 tap water to neutralize the acidic food you eat with acids pH2.5 - pH6. Remember pH 6 is not 1 time more acidic than pH7. It is 10 times. And pH5 would be 100 times more acidic than pH7.
The summary is simple.
1) We eat acidic food and drinks. The pH range from 2 - 6pH. (pH2 is obviously a stronger acid than pH6. & being neutral).
2) We drink alkaline water pH 7.5 - pH9. (The higher pH would logically neutralise the stronger acids of lower pH). This will neutralize the acid waste accummulated over the years, and also the new acids taken in.
Example, drink a glass of soft drink. Low pH of maybe pH2.5? Highly acidic. How many glass of water should you drink to neutralize the acid? Tap water is usually neutral to mild alkaline, say pH7.5. So ph7.5 is ok to neutralize the mild acid around ph6.5 in the same portion.
With a acid of pH2.5, you probably need several glasses of pH9 to neutralize it.
Research has shown that it takes 35 glasses of normal water to neutralize acids from 1 glass of soft drink. Good luck if you can drink that many just for a glass of soft drink, not to mention the other acidic foods!
Here's a pH guide of different items:
<paste>
Substance pH
Hydrochloric acid, 10M -1.0
Lead-acid battery 0.5
Gastric acid 1.5 – 2.0
Lemon juice 2.4
Cola 2.5
Vinegar 2.9
Orange or apple juice 3.5
Tomato Juice 4.0
Beer 4.5
Acid Rain <5.0
Coffee 5.0
Tea or healthy skin 5.0
Urine 6.0
Milk 6.5
Pure Water 7.0 (NEUTRAL pH)
Healthy human saliva 6.5 – 7.4
Blood 7.34 – 7.45
Seawater 7.7 – 8.3
Hand soap 9.0 – 10.0
What a flawed comparison.
The GHPC people usually have little or no real economic knowledge, and are full of emotive crap.
Kind of like the posts above containing a poor (actually no) understanding of chemistry - just emotive crap.
WinstonWolfe,
You seem to be quite aware of the benefit of a proper diet, especially an alkaline diet.
Ideally, we should all return to a diet of fruit and vegies, regular exercise, and we wouldn't need that type of stuff.
Not many people are willing to follow a strict alkaline diet though, removing all meat, milk, and sugar products from their diet.
The alkaline water is another way to achieve similar benefits as an alkaline diet without being so restrictive.
You can dismiss it as a fad if you want, but plenty of people who have tried it have benefited from it.
People who are willing to share their experience openly don't deserve the type of cynicism that you have shown, especially from somebody who understand the benefits of an alkaline diet.
It suits some people. It sounds like you don't need it. But that doesn't mean that it's a scam.
Cheers,
Trog,
A very flawed comparison from you, with lot of wordy labels(eg"emotive crap") with no substance. All opinions.
The point Willfrog was bringing up is this: I am one of the people who have first hand experience in getting benefits from alkaline water. But none of the critics have even tried it, they have absolutely no experience, no knowledge of it, yet they think they know it surely is a scam. Shows clearly who is speaking from experience and who is speaking from assumptions and prejudice.
Georges
Since you've mentioned bloating perhaps you've had gallbladder stones
and drinking massive amounts of water would have helped.
If you are not feeling 100% yet then perhaps the following treatment will be perfect for you.
I haven't tried it myself but some Dr, I don't remember his name now and many people who posted their results in several blogs on the web say it works
http://www.relfe.com/gall_stone_cleanse.html
Since you've mentioned bloating perhaps you've had gallbladder stones
and drinking massive amounts of water would have helped.
If you are not feeling 100% yet then perhaps the following treatment will be perfect for you.
I haven't tried it myself but some Dr, I don't remember his name now and many people who posted their results in several blogs on the web say it works
http://www.relfe.com/gall_stone_cleanse.html
