Highgate WA: R80 Project #2

westminster

westminster

Time to start a thrilling thread on my new project - another Highgate development.

Take off your shoes, curl up on the couch and grab some popcorn.

I'm not going to put figures in yet. My back of the napkin calculations say at least 30% but it's very early days and options to think about.

So what did I buy?

552 sqm block
zoned R80
corner location with 40m long border on a ROW/Laneway

Cost: 1m

Settlement: mid November

Potential

The house needs some work but is retainable and I can either:
1. repeat the Turner Street baby apartment building
2. build possibly 3 houses in the rear facing Phelps Lane (would require demolition of an extension on the front house)
3. build 2 houses in the rear facing Phelps Lane.
4. Demolish front house and build 4 houses
5. Demolish front house and apply for 5% variation on avg block size and build 5 houses.

Photos

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/...073741831.100006363221160&type=1&l=4c55d97744
 
What was supposed to be a simple deal did turn a bit pear shaped today. My contract is already unconditional and the REA rang me up and asked if by any chance I'd be wanting to not go through with it? WTF?

It's an Accountancy/SMSF issue for the Sellers which I won't go into but I said 'no I don't want to back out' and the REA said that he didn't think I would but had to ask just in case.

So it's still going ahead

I have the ball rolling for a Feature survey to be done and that will be done some time soon.
 
If you build 4/5 houses, will you subdivide so they each have there own title? Or will it be some sort of grouped dwelling? Do you get to chose?
 
Myf

I very much like the inner city Perth areas due to the end value and this product very sort after, rents are also very high. We are seeing lots of high income/professionals moving into Highgate/Mt Lawley lots of cash:).

I think I will be looking closer at these areas once I complete my 2 projects.

Cheers
MTR
 
Jake D said:
If you build 4/5 houses, will you subdivide so they each have there own title? Or will it be some sort of grouped dwelling? Do you get to chose?
Click to expand...

As it's a corner block I can do it so that there is no common property and they can have their own title. Block size for Single House or Grouped Dwelling with R80 is minimum 100sqm and average 120 sqm.

Something like these:
http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-wa-mount+lawley-114835083
http://www.realestate.com.au/property-townhouse-wa-east+perth-114247335
http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-wa-north+perth-114393543
 
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Hi WM, loved your last Highgate thread.

I have an idea which may or may not work as I'm not sure how the 5% block variation is applied but what if you applied for the 5% variation and subdivided the block into 5 townhouse's then applied for DA you could sell them as House and Land packages?
This would reduce the level of risk/debt and you can keep 1,2,3 or all if them if you wish. They block value could also be revalued and hopefully worth more?
or would valuation become an issue when the blocks are so small?
 
Sleekman said:
Hi WM, loved your last Highgate thread.

I have an idea which may or may not work as I'm not sure how the 5% block variation is applied but what if you applied for the 5% variation and subdivided the block into 5 townhouse's then applied for DA you could sell them as House and Land packages?
This would reduce the level of risk/debt and you can keep 1,2,3 or all if them if you wish. They block value could also be revalued and hopefully worth more?
or would valuation become an issue when the blocks are so small?
Click to expand...

Yes that is an variation on option 5 which is possible too.
 
OK I need some opinions :)

Scenario: In the 900k-1.2m market where you are building a 4 x 2 in inner city, ie Highgate.

How important is double garage? If it's at the expense of garden/ground floor living area.

The footprint is 110sqm and if 36sqm of that is taken up by garage and 16sqm is compulsory courtyard then there is little room for living on ground floor.

Option:
a. do single garage which solves all problems but is it wise?
b. do tandem garage and reduce living areas
c. do double garage and do massive balcony on top of that to be garden and do upside down living.

I get surprise when I see houses like this on in Edith Street go for around 1m (hazy on actual figure) and it didn't even have a carport just a parking spot

http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-wa-highgate-114207819

I would love to do something like that or a single garage but........
 
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So I think it's going to need to be 2 at the rear not 3.

I'm in a design funk around how to fit 3 around the sewer line on one border. It's just don't think it's going to be possible.

On the garage front I think a single garage with a parking stacker system might be a winner
 
westminster said:
So I think it's going to need to be 2 at the rear not 3.

I'm in a design funk around how to fit 3 around the sewer line on one border. It's just don't think it's going to be possible.

On the garage front I think a single garage with a parking stacker system might be a winner
Click to expand...

Cantilever slab?
 
Hi Myf,

Just saw your earlier post.

Imo Perth isnt ready for 4 bed homes with single carbays, even in such a convenient location so A) would not be an option

also be careful about packing too much house in and not having sufficient outdoor space or having too many bedrooms and losing valuable living room space. That can work with properties on the lower/mid end with villas etc but imo as you get up in price buyers become more fussy and someone spending $1m and possibly having kids with them (being a 4 bed home) might want more than 16sqm of outdoor space.

my folks sold a home last year that was very nicely done, high ceilings, good floorplan etc and a 4x3 but on a small 350 odd sqm block and the small courtyard really held it back when it came time to sell. other houseswith bigger outdoor space on the same block size in the neighbourhood sold quicker and for better prices despite some of them not being quite as nice inside.
the upside down idea with outdoor space on top of the garage could be an option imo
 
westminster said:
So I think it's going to need to be 2 at the rear not 3.

I'm in a design funk around how to fit 3 around the sewer line on one border. It's just don't think it's going to be possible.

On the garage front I think a single garage with a parking stacker system might be a winner
Click to expand...

Hi Myf
Your product and price point over $1M is a tough call as there is no room for mistakes, buyers can purchase a period home on small parcel of land where they can renovate/extend/add value and this is IMO most attractive and your competition if selling.

I would start by finding out what buyers want in this area/what flys out the door not just what you can fit on the block etc. There are some amazing townhouses on corner of Regents St and Beaufort Street, they were built by local builder who owned one, amazing design, great location and just ticked all the boxes. Whenever they come on the market they get snapped up, last one sold for around $1.4M (5 years ago now), my g/friend owns the best one as it was the builder's primary residence. Have a drive and check them out.

Cheers
MTR:)
 
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Hi Westminster,

I'm not sure if this will be any help - the personal view of one couple so not very scientific! Not sure what your target market is. My husband and I are high income professionals with two young children. We recently moved closer to the CBD and we got rid of one car - we need one to trundle the kids around and for weekends when we are mostly together, but during the week public transport is more convenient for work. If we were buying we would prefer more outdoor space to a double garage. We have family members in affluent areas of London and the trend there for professionals with young kids seemed to be towards one family car with public transport filling the gap.

Depends on your market!

Best of luck.

Maggie.
 
sanj said:
Hi Myf,

also be careful about packing too much house in and not having sufficient outdoor space or having too many bedrooms and losing valuable living room space. That can work with properties on the lower/mid end with villas etc but imo as you get up in price buyers become more fussy and someone spending $1m and possibly having kids with them (being a 4 bed home) might want more than 16sqm of outdoor space.

the upside down idea with outdoor space on top of the garage could be an option imo
Click to expand...

Having more than 16m2 is a must in my opinion if I'm doing 4 bedroom. If I do a single sized garage with a parking stacker so it houses 2 cars I might be onto something.

MTR said:
Hi Myf
Your product and price point over $1M is a tough call as there is no room for mistakes, buyers can purchase a period home on small parcel of land where they can renovate/extend/add value and this is IMO most attractive and your competition if selling.

I would start by finding out what buyers want in this area/what flys out the door not just what you can fit on the block etc. There are some amazing townhouses on corner of Regents St and Beaufort Street, they were built by local builder who owned one, amazing design, great location and just ticked all the boxes. Whenever they come on the market they get snapped up, last one sold for around $1.4M (5 years ago now), my g/friend owns the best one as it was the builder's primary residence. Have a drive and check them out.

Cheers
MTR:)
Click to expand...

I will check them out and do a lot more DD with local REAs. Just brainstorming at the moment and trying things out.

MaggieMcT said:
Hi Westminster,

I'm not sure if this will be any help - the personal view of one couple so not very scientific! Not sure what your target market is. My husband and I are high income professionals with two young children. We recently moved closer to the CBD and we got rid of one car - we need one to trundle the kids around and for weekends when we are mostly together, but during the week public transport is more convenient for work. If we were buying we would prefer more outdoor space to a double garage. We have family members in affluent areas of London and the trend there for professionals with young kids seemed to be towards one family car with public transport filling the gap.

Depends on your market!

Best of luck.

Maggie.
Click to expand...

Thanks Maggie. Good to hear the view point of people that are living close to the city. It is highly likely that the market is high end double incommers who like to entertain - ie need outdoor area and good living areas and/or people with children.
 
Myf

The new homes, around Plunkett Street are pretty ugly and have been hard to move.

I think most owners could not work out what to build in an area which is predominantly period homes. The area is screaming for something special, I know if anyone can do it, it would be you;)
 
MTR said:
Myf

The new homes, around Plunkett Street are pretty ugly and have been hard to move.

I think most owners could not work out what to build in an area which is predominantly period homes. The area is screaming for something special, I know if anyone can do it, it would be you;)
Click to expand...

Thanks M, I have some good ideas for something fairly classical/period but modern - picking the best of both I hope!

These ones on Regent? http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-wa-mount+lawley-105429956
 
westminster said:
Thanks M, I have some good ideas for something fairly classical/period but modern - picking the best of both I hope!

These ones on Regent? http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-wa-mount+lawley-105429956
Click to expand...

I think there are eight townhouses in all, four on each side of the street, this link is one of the older townhouses, same builder, but perhaps built 8-10 years ago, as you can see a little out dated now. Opposite are the townhouses I mentioned which are not as old, much better elevation/look etc. Also, this location is premier so would achieve top $.

This builder also just completed another home on Clifton Street, very small block, got the X factor from the front, double storey, white picket fence, near First Avenue. I will post the address/number tomorrow.

Cheers
MTR
 
Edith St is a 4 bed with single. Allows 2x living areas and 2 balconies with city views from master.

One carbay. Valuations came back good...why? Because you can apply for a street parking permit if you push.
 
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