Underquoting and jaded buyers

I had an interesting conversation with a buyer recently (not my client) who was so sick of missing out at auctions they have now decided to avoid them altogether. Not so common really- lots of buyers do this already as they prefer transparency in pricing. However, it turned out that this particular buyer was avoiding auctions by a couple of particular agencies due to their very history of underquoting price guides and often being 10-15% under the final price result. No surprises there either- I agreed with him as I've often found these particular agencies to quote low.

The trouble arises, however, when the informed buying public realise that such agencies underquote as a matter of common practice (thus ignoring the property) causing the strategy to backfire for the agencies in question. One agent told me recently that he was really surprised a property of his was passed in with no bids when a very similar one was sold by PT some weeks earlier (by a different agency) at the same price guide he'd been advertising. The agency is high profile and known to underquote- when I pointed this out to him, he was defensive initially but then admitted that it may well have been the reason why the property didn't attract as much interest. Jaded buyers have had enough, in some circumstances, and I thought it was well illustrated in this particular circumstance.

Insider info from another party (seller) told me the same agency (but different area) approached them with a listing presentation and suggested a price guide of $820K+ for AUCTION but with a written price estimate of $900-940K on the sales agreement. Other private treaty agencies provided suggested prices ranging from: Offers over $890K, $939K and Range $890-950K. The seller eventually went with the agent who appeared the most experienced in the area (and demonstrated the likelihood of achieving early $900K's- most realistic price) and was disgusted in the AUCTION agency's suggested tactics for collecting buyers with a price guide that she had no intention of accepting. If only more vendors were like herself so the industry could be cleaned up here. It's no good just blaming agents for underquoting- vendors are often willing partners in the process and it ends up simply leaving a sour taste in the mouths of buyers.
 
Yep I've got two agencies on my boycott list for this same reason and they
are not to far from your Hills district Jacque.

Don't even bother to open up the alerts from these guy's anymore.
 
I was at an OFI on Saturday and my guess was early to mid $500K's (but kept that to myself).

As I was preparing to leave, I heard someone ask the selling agent in attendance for a price guide. The agent said "We are quoting offers over $470K". :rolleyes:

I spoke up and said "Oh please, it is going to go for well over $500K!". The agent gave me one of 'those' looks and said "Yes, it will go for over $500K easily enough."

I dunno what they hope to gain (other than bigger numbers at the auction) by this sort of tactic.:confused: as well as more jaded buyers, as you say Jacque.
 
I don't get this either, and i'm in the industry :eek:

My guess is that they get more contacts, more exposure, not sure? As a buyer myself I hate when agents under quote, then they rant and rave about "tyre kickers" :rolleyes: It's funny because if you gave the buyer the right price in the first place you'd have less of these as they can actually afford the property!
 
I don't get this either, and i'm in the industry :eek:

My guess is that they get more contacts, more exposure, not sure? As a buyer myself I hate when agents under quote, then they rant and rave about "tyre kickers" :rolleyes: It's funny because if you gave the buyer the right price in the first place you'd have less of these as they can actually afford the property!

Hi Lil

You're spot on about one of the reasons- more exposure means a bigger crowd at the auction, by enticing buyers in with a lower price tag. When us humans see a large gathering we assume that there must be something worthwhile for sale - a bit like the street busker encouraging his audience to applaud loudly so a larger crowd is naturally drawn in....

The second reason is because agents love "emotional" buyers- those purchasers who may well ignore their instincts/bank balances/common sense on the day and bid well over their pre-determined sensibly agreed limit. I've seen it time and time again (as I'm sure Alan has) where the adrenalin rush kicks in and they just HAVE to have that property. When you also consider the money and time already invested in auction properties, it's little wonder at times that buyers get carried away and pay more. The pace of the auction can be their downfall, as can the awful practice of the selling agent hovering constantly in their ear, reminding them that this is their last chance, golden opportunity, it's only $20K more, stay confident or you'll lose it, you're so close to the reserve don't give up now etc etc.

Auctions are not for the faint hearted, especially when it comes to buying PPOR's. But many agents love them, for all of the reasons above and because it often means the property sells faster (standard auction campaign is 4-6 weeks) and the vendor can, too, be more easily swayed to accept a figure below their reserve in the heat and excitement (or should that be disappointment?) of the big day. So much planning goes into them, and with so much expectation, build up and fanfare it's not at all surprising that emotions can rule the day.

Don't get me wrong- I'm not at all against auctions. I'm just for more transparency on sales agreement estimates and legislating that these estimates ONLY are provided as price guides for auctions.
 
The second reason is because agents love "emotional" buyers- those purchasers who may well ignore their instincts/bank balances/common sense on the day and bid well over their pre-determined sensibly agreed limit.

A little while ago I was looking at a PPOR, but as soon as the agent said they had a couple who had been hounding them daily for the section 32 and were ready to buy as soon as they got it, I turned around and said I was no longer interested.

Why? Because I know that they were trying to get me to make an offer and push to my limit, because i'm obviously young and dumb ( :rolleyes: ) but I heard "emotional" buyer and went, nope, not worth my time they can have it. Under contract within the week, can't say I was surprised.

Although, agents aren't just under quoting on auctions, it's private sales too - But we already knew that. I don't get why agents aren't working harder to shake their bad reputation, after all it's their commission.
 
I have had agents take "other prospective buyers" through properties that we were reviewing a second time.

These were arranged as private appointment inspections and on each my better half advised the agent that we are not interested in playing their games.

One that we placed a cheeky offer had a reply from the agent that over 16 had taken out contracts and that their advise to the owner was not to deviate from the listed price despite having committed else.

(Should never leave those docs out when having an inspection)

Well, 5 months on and still on the market.
 
It's not just auctions either. We were interested in a private sale property which had an advertised range of $235K - $275K. My wife was asking lots of questions of the agent and found out 2 offers had already been rejected and after a bit more probing discovered the vendor would not consider any offers below $270K :eek:

Which just made me walk away no longer interested...
 
It's not just auctions either. We were interested in a private sale property which had an advertised range of $235K - $275K. My wife was asking lots of questions of the agent and found out 2 offers had already been rejected and after a bit more probing discovered the vendor would not consider any offers below $270K :eek:

Which just made me walk away no longer interested...


Why did you walk? :confused:

If the property is not worth that much.......fair enough.

If it is and you were enticed by the lowish end of the range, you should not be bothered as it's in the quoted range............and that also assumes that the rea isn't telling porkeis and that there actually have been other offers. ;)
 
Why did you walk? :confused:

If the property is not worth that much.......fair enough.

If it is and you were enticed by the lowish end of the range, you should not be bothered as it's in the quoted range............and that also assumes that the rea isn't telling porkeis and that there actually have been other offers. ;)

Being enticed by the lowish end of the range only to be informed the vendor will not consider any offers below $270K to me is false advertising and under-quoting which I am not interested in taking any further from there. Plenty of other properties I am looking at than to waste my time with ones that have been falsely advertised
 
Being enticed by the lowish end of the range only to be informed the vendor will not consider any offers below $270K to me is false advertising and under-quoting which I am not interested in taking any further from there. Plenty of other properties I am looking at than to waste my time with ones that have been falsely advertised

In Melbourne (and I'm assuming you are buying here), they underquote, so add circa 5-10 %.........get used to it ;)

They are the phantom rules here for the most part. I am not agreeing with the process by the way. However that's how it is. Learn the rules and play by those rules.

I am not having a go at you :( however if and only IF that particular property was worth 270 K or slightly more, just walking away b/c the way the game is played pushes your buttons, may see you miss an opportunity.

You haven't outlined in your post that it was not in your opinion worth that much. If that's the case, fair enough......next.

Peace :)
 
People should be researching the areas before they attend auctions to begin with.

I actually don't mind seeing places underquoted, it's a good indication of what the market is like and what people are prepared to pay for places.

It's no good just blaming agents for underquoting- vendors are often willing partners in the process and it ends up simply leaving a sour taste in the mouths of buyers.

There is no problem here. The vendor is going to do whatever it takes to sell their place for a premium. What's next, vendors shouldn't tidy up or renovate their place on the RE's advice?

PS I don't work in real estate. :)
 
In Melbourne (and I'm assuming you are buying here), they underquote, so add circa 5-10 %.........get used to it ;)

They are the phantom rules here for the most part. I am not agreeing with the process by the way. However that's how it is. Learn the rules and play by those rules.

I am not having a go at you :( however if and only IF that particular property was worth 270 K or slightly more, just walking away b/c the way the game is played pushes your buttons, may see you miss an opportunity.

You haven't outlined in your post that it was not in your opinion worth that much. If that's the case, fair enough......next.

Peace :)

This one was in Bendigo. IMO it was not worth $270K+ and I believe the vendor's expectation's were too high, we looked at it 5-6 weeks ago and it is still on the market(not that that means a lot) and I believe it had already been on the market for a bit. 5% I'd probably not be so picky about but this is effectively 12% and there seemed to be a fair few which were closer to the mark
 
What about when a listing agent won't advise an indicative price range?

I have asked several agents from the same company if they can provide a price range as to what they believe a particular property is worth or what the owner is expecting and have received the same answer; We don't know what it is worth, the market will dictate that on Auction day.
 
I haven't got an issue with it, seriously. I expect REAs to tell porkies.
I actually enjoy baiting them to see how far they'll go.
Give a crook enough rope kinda thing.

I've got a very good memory for such encounters. Many REAs don't realize how small a world it is and how they have only one reputation.

Anyone who is serious about bidding really has to determine market value via their own dd.
 
In Melbourne (and I'm assuming you are buying here), they underquote, so add circa 5-10 %.........get used to it ;)

They are the phantom rules here for the most part. I am not agreeing with the process by the way. However that's how it is. Learn the rules and play by those rules.

I am not having a go at you :( however if and only IF that particular property was worth 270 K or slightly more, just walking away b/c the way the game is played pushes your buttons, may see you miss an opportunity.

You haven't outlined in your post that it was not in your opinion worth that much. If that's the case, fair enough......next.

Peace :)

Player,

he may not want to take part in the whole deception game.

as in, even purchasing and being a part of it encourages the practise further.

cheers.
 
I had an interesting conversation with a buyer recently (not my client) who was so sick of missing out at auctions they have now decided to avoid them altogether.

Not only do you miss out, but you have to suffer egotistical auctioneer agents trying to look like CEO's in cars and suits they can't afford and annoying you with their rhetoric.

Give me a private sale, and Saturdays off to have fun anyday.

Having said that, nothing annoys agents more than the buyer who says nothing to them during the whole ad campaign and shows no interest, and then comes in right at the last minute of the "are you all done - we are here to sell" garbage and puts in one bid, which is still below the reserve but above the last bidder, wins the final (passed in) bid and then doesn't proceed any further; just walks away from the whole scene.
 
What about when a listing agent won't advise an indicative price range?

I have asked several agents from the same company if they can provide a price range as to what they believe a particular property is worth or what the owner is expecting and have received the same answer; We don't know what it is worth, the market will dictate that on Auction day.

Ay yes..... Ray White's standard response. You're actually better off going around the question by asking them what comps they used to appraise this property. This can often be a better method and prevents the agents from possibly being prosecuted for underquoting (not that it happens very much anyway!)
 
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